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a Tip of the Hat to Scoutdog--wait, maybe that was a Poke in the Ribs...
Published on June 14, 2009 By Philocthetes In WOM Ideas

We know the game will have spells, but we're within a fortnight or less of the non-NDA alpha we still know just about nothing about how channelers will learn new spells. So the time for pie-in-the-sky ideas, heckling, etc., is dwindling. With that in mind, I think that the Five Elements need to be partnered with Five Ways to Learn Your Spells:

  • Inherent research ability for channeler and some champions
  • Bonuses and/or direct production from infrastructure
  • Diplomatic exchanges (trades, tribute, honor-gifts--hopefully including independent powers like elder dragons and Geoff the Slug)
  • Quests (dungeons)
  • Events

I chose bullets because I generally don't like being asked to give rank-ordered lists for anything. I'm a former recovering postmodernist. But the bullets are more or less in what I think of as Most to Least Important order.


Comments (Page 1)
on Jun 14, 2009

I'm not that slow.

 

I like all of those, assuming the second is MoM style bonuses and not a massive research center that takes over as the primary research function.  The channeler should definitely be the main man when it comes to researching his own spells.  After all, if he's the only magic wielding titan, he's the only one that can figure out what titanic things he can do with his magic.

on Jun 14, 2009

Sounds good.
(I mean, c'mon. What else can I say?)

on Jun 14, 2009

Bullets are for losers?

on Jun 14, 2009

I had hoped to see some experimentation in the magic system as well. Where you could adjust certain modifiers on spells (perhaps basic spells) to create a totally new spell. Although if spell research is very linear experimentation won't have much of a place in Elemental. 

on Jun 14, 2009

I like. However, I have to disagree with Psychoak on his assertion that research centres should not eclipse the channeler's power. Instead, I fell that they should become the main source of spell income for Sauron people, BUT spell research ability should increase with the amount of essence you have stored: learning the intuitive ways of magic and all that. This will, in my opinion, balance out the Gandalfs and the Saurons better than ineffective imps.

on Jun 14, 2009

could magic items grant spell-like abilities?   Like effectivly granting spell that can only be cast once every 5 turns (and it be added to the spell book and everything)

on Jun 14, 2009

Guess it all depends on how the devs (and modders) code the thing. Since the engine is going to be moddable to some degree, if it's not possible @ the start, someone will make it possible. Which reminds me: I'm assuming that sort of thing is already layed out at this point, but would it be too much to ask for a universal cross-file tag system that will allow us to set the internal name of any "object" be it tech, spell, or building as the requirement or unlockable of any other object?

on Jun 14, 2009

You've played MoM right?  Lots of highly improved cities would eclipse the channeler's personal addition, but individual cities did not.

 

So the guy with oodles of improved cities would research faster than the guy with one, but the channeler alone might be worth three or four cities all by himself.

on Jun 14, 2009

I have not had the chance to play MoM, but what you are saying makes sense. Balance is elusive, but I think that we have it here.

on Jun 14, 2009

Yeah, I just don't want individual improvements to be more powerful than channelers for researching channeler specific stuff.  Having essence wouldn't be particularly important, as you'd have nothing much to do with it compared to the other guy who's nuking your ass with a world ending spell.

on Jun 14, 2009

Oh, obviously.  I build a small library and I suddenly have more spell knowledge than the Great Arctherus?! Not a good idea.

I put in the essence mechanic because there has to be some way for the Gandalf channeler to get more research ability that the Sauron channeler cannot easily replecate. If you are spending it all on cities and stuff, it won't be around to make you better with spells.

on Jun 14, 2009

Scoutdog
I have not had the chance to play MoM, but what you are saying makes sense. Balance is elusive, but I think that we have it here.
What do you mean "have not had the chance"? It's [link removed]

psychoak
You've played MoM right?  Lots of highly improved cities would eclipse the channeler's personal addition, but individual cities did not.

So the guy with oodles of improved cities would research faster than the guy with one, but the channeler alone might be worth three or four cities all by himself.
I'm with Psy.

on Jun 14, 2009

What do you mean "have not had the chance"? It's widely available and free.

Oh. I thought it was still being sold for cash...... thanks for the link!

on Jun 15, 2009

Scoutdog
I like. However, I have to disagree with Psychoak on his assertion that research centres should not eclipse the channeler's power. Instead, I fell that they should become the main source of spell income for Sauron people, BUT spell research ability should increase with the amount of essence you have stored: learning the intuitive ways of magic and all that. This will, in my opinion, balance out the Gandalfs and the Saurons better than ineffective imps.

This sort of thing is one of the reasons I did a bullet list and not a numbered list. I think you might be onto something with wanting some way to have spell research work differently for different play styles (strategies).

on Jun 15, 2009

heh, I thought of  a funny item (related to this)   

item:

specticles (or bifocals, or something similar):   increases research by channeler by +5%

 

It would be nice if you could upgrade the research of your channeler as well as cities.   I imagine that cities ultimatly are going to be your main resource and income source no matter what you do, but a very powerful channeler should be able to at least be comparable.   He could also have improvements that directly relate to the city he is in, at which point I'm not sure who would be credited for the research (say he has the "traveled scholar" trait, and he gets a bonus for every library with a connected trade network with the town where he resides.)